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Blog: On Killing

It is time for local leaders to deal with the cold, hard realities of an armed society before the pundits' window-dressing solutions set us up for greater disaster.

The title of this post comes from a series of the same name by US Army Lieutenant Colonel Dave Grossman.  Its focus (and that of its sequel, "The Bullet Proof Mind") is cold, hard truths about battle, and how those of us in the profession of arms must adapt to them.

This is something with which civilians should never have to be burdened. 

Sadly, "killing" is extremely relevant in light of the horror of last Friday morning. As the father of a toddler son, I am wracked by the idea that children barely older than him spent their final few moments in the terror I knew in an ambush on a narrow mountain-top road across from the Pakistan border. I know what it is to assume you are about to die, and cannot fathom what that must have been like for those so little.

But almost as bothersome been the endless bluster of "solutions" and "action" from people who plainly know nothing about the use of force.  These ivory-tower pundits are setting us up for disasters that will only be known when the 911 calls come in from malls, schools or theaters.   The grandstanding of Senator Dianne Feinstein and our own local congressional delegation will us with window dressing protection, devoid of any practical, tactical value. Feinstein knows nothing of the cold, hard facts of battle.

Here’s a fact:  Europe, with gun bans Feinstein envies, has had more school shootings resulting in 10 or more fatalities in the last decade (five) than has the US (two).

Here’s a another cold, hard fact: only effective method of eliminating a threat of force is rapid application of superior force. The yapping about "assault weapons" and "high capacity magazines" is trivial.

Let's start with "assault weapons."  The media tells us the Bushmaster .223 is a "high-powered assault weapon.” It is not.  The .223 (or 5.56mm NATO equivalent) class of weapons is quite low on the nastiness scale.  In fact, it is well documented that the .223 system was adopted during Vietnam because it caused less damage than higher caliber weapons.

These weapons burden the enemy with caring for casualties who survive. Weapons like the AK-47 are far more lethal, and hunting rifles are a class above that -- they take out 400-pound Elk.

But, put against tiny children, and .223s might as well be grenades. A hunting rifle in the Sandyhook classrooms would have required far fewer rounds to do much worse damage.

More bothersome, much smaller weapons have been put to more evil purpose.

Virginia Tech remains the most lethal mass murder in American history (not counting acts of war). The killer used two mid-caliber pistols, a 9mm and a .22. There are few weapons smaller than these, yet he was able to kill more people than any murderer in American history.

An assault rifle ban would have done nothing to prevent that horror.  Moreover, those (and much larger calibers) are precisely the weapons that people use for home defense and which politicians make a point of protecting.

All home defense and hunting weapons are designed to destroy.  It’s that simple.  If people are going to be allowed to protect themselves, there will always be a risk.

The blabbering crowd also spews about "high capacity magazines.”  Having to make fewer magazine changes is a convenience, I'll admit.  But I've changed magazines under fire and had little impact on my ability to engage targets.  And, anyone with an hour's practice can be fairly good at it.  

The fact is, the shock of being under an unexpected assault (especially if from a hunting rifle) will negate any value from a pause for a few extra magazine changes.  And, that value would depend on a crazed, determined killer not being able to obtain such magazines outside the law.

Again, Virgina Tech is the tragic illustration. The killer used two pistols with 19 magazines to shoot 50 people in nine minutes.  A few extra magazines changes would have barely broken his stride.   

But what did concern the VT killer was intervention – i.e. superior force.  He chained the doors of the target building, thus holding his victims in range and keeping responders at bay.  With no threat from within, he was free to continue his massacre at will.

This is the cold, hard reality.  Once killings like those in Aurora, Sandyhook or Virginia Tech start, the victims’ fate rests on the killers’ insane whim and the driving skills of the local police officers.

It is this equation which our local leaders must address.  Issues like assault weapon definitions and magazine limits are beyond the influence of the Monrovia School Board and Monrovia City Council. Questions of hardening facilities to prevent unauthorized access are logical prophylactic measures. But the issue our local officials really need to address is a brutal discussion of what will happen once a shooter gets inside a school or public building.  In a city that often only has five or six patrol cops on the street at a given time (assuming they are not tied up on the other side of town), there are few good options.

Having real, deliberate plans based on real scenarios (like Aurora and Sandyhook) with no-holds barred analysis of what really might happen is the only true way this community will protect itself from the cold, hard facts.

There is another way, of course.  Last week, before Sandyhook, there was a shooting at an Oregon mall that was interrupted by a person with a concealed carry permit. Though he did not fire, the presence of a capable opponent seems to have brought the assault to a quicker end.

I do not advocate for a careless distribution of concealed weapons permits.  Many of the most vocal advocates of them should be last to get one. Allowing educators to have guns on campus is an idea which requires very careful, deliberate consideration.

But the cold, hard tactical reality is that the only way to end an assault once it begins is the rapid application of superior force.  You can wish away and demonize whatever objects and groups you want. You can assume it will never happen here.  I pray it does not.

But, the laws of ballistics and tactics are all that matter, once someone starts killing.  There are no ifs.  Only when.

Hugo Torres December 18, 2012 at 08:27 pm
The cold hard fact is that American's thrive in debate and revision of policies. This is the fuel that fires the engine pushing us towards a more perfect union. I concede that Mr. Parry has somewhat more education on the efficiency of weapons and tactics. My challenge to the post is that it doesn't really ask any questions or provides any answers other than turning our citizenry into individuals who are constantly looking for how to apply a "superior force." We need to have a dialogue in American about guns, mental illness and how they relate to one another. Those are subjects that we can do something about. Because I agree, the laws of ballistics are hard set and very difficult to argue against.
Dan Crandell December 19, 2012 at 01:39 am
@Robert ... Your polished military bearing shines clear and load . I salute and thank You Sir. I can't wait to read comments on this blog.
Robert Parry December 19, 2012 at 03:42 am
Hugo: You note that I neither ask questions nor provide answers. On the contrary I do both. Unfortunately, both are odious and unpleasant, and perhaps unrecognizeable as such.
Here's the basic question: At the local level, there is little that can be done to prevent these incidents and most of what's proposed at the national level is fatally flawed. What are our community leaders prepared to do to address the "after the first shot" questions? Rapid application of superior force is the only real answer to such situations. Most methods for this are reliant on first-responders (police) who are rarely immediately (rapidly) available. Citizens may well offer more rapid response, but are not without risk. I do not, by any measure, want a citizenry "constantly looking" to apply force. Preparation is different than desire. But the cost of not being prepared has been paid too many times.
Robert Parry December 19, 2012 at 03:43 am
Thank you, sir.
Chris Ziegler December 19, 2012 at 02:50 pm
Robert,
When you chase these types of ideas out you’d find that we simply can't afford to have armed experts on-site at every "soft target" and the resulting accidental deaths are certain to outnumber the senseless killings on a long enough timeline. - And it's not as though the "experts" never snap. If you were thinking that we'd arm the facility, I'd respond, go meet the faculty: They're great people and wonderfully dedicated educators but most (99%) aren't warriors, good warriors have warrior genes and these deeds are accomplished in seconds. Keep in mind this is not Pakistan where you can "spray and pray" and/or call in the CAPs (Combat Air Patrols) to lay waste to just about everything and everyone in the vicinity of the bad people. It's a lot easier to get away with collateral damage (by some counts, over a million dead civilians from the oil wars) when its 13,000 miles away and they are of lesser human stature. The other options I'd rather see employed are: Get treatment for the disturbed, make sure the disturbed aren't trained in fire arms!!, teach kids how to evade "bad people" (allegedly, the kids that fled the scene survived), I hope the current protocol, "take cover on the floor and wait for rescue" is promptly reviewed and amended appropriately. I've taught my daughter to shield herself with books and beat feet if a bad person arrives at her class. I bet you can testify to how profoundly more difficult to hit a moving target.
Dan Crandell December 19, 2012 at 10:56 pm
@Robert Turn on ABC World News starting right now. A report on ARMED guards on school yards.
Dan Crandell December 19, 2012 at 11:53 pm
@Robert If you missed it no problem. Nothing of value. Only a bunch of people with opinions and we know what those are like.
Robert Parry December 20, 2012 at 02:27 am
Chris:
I'm fairly well aware that the Afghanistan Rules of Engagement don't apply in the US. I'm all for greatly enhanced mental health care. I've worked on skid row and seen the bottom layer of a tragically dysfunctional system. I'm in favor of laws requiring safes/lock boxes (but not trigger locks) for weapons. Either of those alone might have prevented Sandyhook. But all prevention measures can fail and (in this matter) ultimately will. Again, the only way to bring an assault to an end once it is underway is immediate superior force. I never used the word "expert." Most police officers will tell you most cops aren't weapons experts. They train with weapons on a very infrequent basis -- some only quarterly. What they have is the character, trustworthiness and (generally) fortitude to maintain their bearing under great stress and... wait for it... immediately apply superior force when attacked. Unfortunately, if one is not around at the right time, the tragedy is a fait accompli. A moving target is hard to hit. But not hard enough. Someone with two pistols with 10-round magazines in a classroom or public gathering will do horrific damage unless presented a compelling threat. Again, I don;t advocate everyone having guns. It is indeed a good thing that most teachers are not cut out for gun fights. But some are. There are wolves, sheep and sheep dogs. Society needs more sheep dogs. And they don't all have to be in uniform.
Robert Parry December 20, 2012 at 02:33 am
Thanks. I'll look for it online.
Unfortunately, I know ABC News' bent on these thigns. After Aurora they did an experiment showing how hard it is for a person to overcome an armed assault. They put "armed" citizens with airsoft gun in classrooms full of people, then had an assailant come in shooting. Every time the armed citizen was eventually put down by the assailant. But they never looked at the critical metric: How many more innocents escaped unharmed because the killer was momentarily distracted?
Dan Crandell December 24, 2012 at 03:29 am
Robert Please tell me your thoughts on the NRA's proposals for a School Shield Security Program? Did you see the press conference? Your thoughts are important to me.
Chris Ziegler December 24, 2012 at 02:46 pm
Dan and all:
Regarding this idea of 'we need superior firepower': Please, use your critical thinking and just do the math, how many seconds does it take to shoot unsuspecting victims? Answer: about 1.5 seconds on average, when you have high target density and you are using a semi-automatic weapon. Arming teachers or posting a guard is merely an added higher priority target, (in plain English, you shoot high priority targets first or otherwise incapacitate them such as splash them with acid or an incendiary). So let's take this one step farther, let's spend billions and turn schools in to maximum security prisons. What will happen then? I'm going to guess that those bent on destruction will just find the next best soft target; the library? Chuck E. Cheese? The Little Gym? Our street fair? Who knows where? What should we do? Like I said before; teach citizens to react more effectively i.e. run, throw books at the assailant. If we are going to buy anything, buy ballistic shields and Tasers or other non-lethal directed energy weapons. Even if we had a teacher that was a former combat experienced special forces operator (the common soldier or gun enthusiast, is not qualified to respond in a school shooting situation); Statistics indicate it is more likely that his weapon is more likely to be misused than used properly.
Robert Parry December 26, 2012 at 11:50 pm
Dan: I thought it was ridiculous and amazingly tone-deaf. Armed, uniformed security in schools are the kinds of things middle America associates with bad, dangerous schools. As shocking as Sandyhook was, the horrible aura will eventually wear off. Do we want armed guards reminding us of that day the way TSA agents do 9/11 everytime we go to the airport? Of course not. An extremely low-key and subtle but serious counter-threat would be more than enough.
Uniformed guards are easily monitored and targeted. And, they are a waste of money, as 99.999% of schools are NEVER attacked. It would be more than enough to issue CCWs to school staff who want to and volunteer to have them. They should qualify quarterly, like most police officers do, but then all CCW holders should. It would also be wise to have any CCW holder with frequent presence at a school (to include parents) undergo some additional training, though probably not mandatorily so. You don't need teachers to perform enter-and-clear battle drills. They don't need much in the way of tactics at all. They just a bit of simulated exposure to the possibility, something most of them will have mentally processed just by signing up. Plus some rules for safe handling of weapons (ie. in a concealed safe, and never ever pull that weapon out when anyone can see, unless it is a true emergency).
Robert Parry December 26, 2012 at 11:58 pm
Gee, Chris. Thanks for the suggestion that I use critical thinking. Hadn't considered that idea.
Guns are a threat that will not go away. The gun for the next massacre is most likely ALREADY in the killer's hands, tonight and even if you banned guns tomorrow, he's the last guy that will turn his in. You don't need to be a Green Beret to effectively use a weapon to end a threat. This guy saved a stack of lives without firing a shot -- oh, and he was well aware of the his target background. Imagine that. http://www.kgw.com/news/Clackamas-man-armed-confronts-mall-shooter-183593571.html Last thought: We've known for decades that you'll never get guns out of America. Wouldn't it have been better if someone at Sandyhook's front office had gone to that door with a pistol, instead of bare hands?
Dan Crandell December 27, 2012 at 03:16 am
@Robert Thank you for responding to my request. With respect and I say that not to set you up for a display of disrespect. Your statements are not in keeping with the NRA news conference proposals to address school safety. If you have viewed the ENTIRE news conference I find it unbelievable that you have reached conclusions such as these. If you choose not to respond I will accept that.
R. Ray Morford January 3, 2013 at 05:52 pm
Robert....thank you for your educated comments. I'm sure you would not have started this blog if they were not heart felt. After 36+ years in Law Enforcement, I fully understand the proper use of force. I also fully understand the need for our mental health programs to be repaired and updated. Not later, but now. These programs should go hand in hand. This should never be a political issue from the right or left. Just clear heads doing the right thing.
Robert Parry January 3, 2013 at 07:43 pm
Thank, you, sir. I completely agree that mental health care is the key piece.
Dan Crandell January 4, 2013 at 04:01 am
@R.Ray Do you support a proactive boots on the ground approach to secure the safety of OUR children in OUR schools? You are no doubt retired and possibly a grandfather. Do you support the NRA's proposal for a School Shield Program. This program seems "clear headed" and "the right thing to do". Most people are quick to reject it based on a bias against the NRA. What say you Officer Morford?
Cathy McCallum March 14, 2013 at 09:05 pm
Gosh, Robert. You win. Your remarks regarding the dangers posed by guns not classified as assault weapons have convinced me that the assault weapons ban should be expanded to include all guns except hunting rifles; and further, that hunting rifles and their ammunition should be strictly controlled. Thanks for clarifying my thinking on this issue.
Gayle M. Montgomery March 15, 2013 at 03:59 am
Gee, following tonight's Town Hall, isn't it interesting that Cathy, who keeps thinking folks are picking on her candidate, would sound in on a several months' old blog to assail Mr. Parry. I am so loving these small town politics with their obvious motives.

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rubberband June 19, 2013 at 10:29 am
Perhaps I am unclear on what exactly you would have done? Take away visas from Chinese only? NotRead More allow anyone pregnant to cross our boarders even with a visa? Pregnancy tests at the boarder? Or start a fund for what you call "the hard-working Mexican people?" I am going to assume you were kidding and waxing sardonic when you wrote that they don't have the luxury of staying in a decent hotel...and I really find myself hoping that you have some idea of the WORLD you live in, not just your immediate area. This is not an attack; it is a very real appeal to ask : What would you have DONE about it? Please allow issues of legality, human ethical behavior, financial liability, and finally a realistic approach to your response.
Kate K. June 19, 2013 at 10:59 am
Are you all standing at the Arcadia City Council meetings, telling the City and Arcadia Police Dept.Read More to crack down on these hotels that are turned into "birthing houses" ? If its not against any statute then YOU need to work to get a statute drafted and enacted as law to stop this. YOU are "We the People", and if you don't make the laws, someone else will. Complaining online may make us feel better, but it will resolve nothing.
Brenda Winner June 19, 2013 at 03:45 pm
Be part of the change you insist on happening. Bring some ideas out and present them to whoeverRead More needs to see tham. You make it sound like its a situation that you think is not your problem but yet you expect smeone else to make it better You have no clue about the culture, the reasoning or the attempts that may have been made or are in the works. Lend a hand.
rubberband June 12, 2013 at 10:17 pm
See other post about this: It needed to happen...(Ancient Burial Ground that was desecrated) but IRead More maintain we should get some sort of "cleansing" or burn some incense/sage or call for an exorcism. I believe the evil mojo needs to be banished before we build again.........
donna mills June 8, 2013 at 04:40 pm
Hi Therese, I am good friends with Star Shields. He is a busy face painter, and often needs back-upRead More either at the Summer festival in Laguna Beach, now underway, or with one of his other commitments. If you're interested, I would be happy to give you his contact details via email.
Therese B. June 8, 2013 at 11:08 pm
Hi Donna! Star is a good friend of mine too!!! He is more an airbrush artist (and a darn goodRead More one!!) then a face painter. But he is truly a legend in his craft. I have been lucky enough to work with him and learn from him too! I just wish he wasn't so far away :( Nice to hear from you!
donna mills June 11, 2013 at 03:52 pm
Oh wow! what a small world! Best, Donna
rubberband June 7, 2013 at 04:22 pm
Old fashioned country vet "patchin' up" was some of the cool stuff I was taught growingRead More up. Splinting a bird's wing or leg, getting a thorn out of a slightly infected cat or dog paw was part of learning. I am NOT saying to eliminate/not see a REAL vet, however some things can be handled at home with a bit of basic medical knowledge and Bactine/hot clean water and towels/tweezers and some loving hands to hold Fido or Snowball when you can do it yourself. I am already bracing myself for the angry openly hostile messages this post might draw, so it's OK if you feel the need to do so. Watching some of my older friends who have limited income spend THOUSANDS of dollars for a beloved pet out of pressure/and what I call "pusher's guilt" sorta made me feel like mentioning that in the old days, some of the animal care was done by a wise farm woman/man...not all vets are crooks, and not all pet needs need put you in the poor house.
lynn June 7, 2013 at 07:24 pm
I love the old farmers remedies, particularly for mange however when dealing with elderly animalsRead More and certain conditions you just get around it. The farmers remedies are often slow working causing more pain then an animal needs to go through. I try holistic meds quite often for some bacterial infections and they are slow too. Cats in particular are difficult treat. They are great in some situations but in others the it is not appropriate. I will attempt the at home first then the vet. My recent situation was a neglected kitty I rescued with a 1.25 lb cyst I had no idea she had the cyst just thought she was matted. I was trying to get her shaved. Kitty's don't cooperate for though things. One thing led to another she ends up on the operating table. No rescue groups would help me and that's where my anger is directed. I have been donating to different groups monthly for more then 20 years. At one point three different groups at the same time. No one helped me when I needed it. I'm done.
rubberband June 8, 2013 at 11:31 pm
@Lynn: Reading your posts I felt some anger FOR you. HUGE animal lover here, and ALL my pets areRead More rescues/fosters except for the Robo dwarf hamster. Love my cats, and know there just some things you can't do to a kitty without risking kitty AND your own safety. What you have experienced was pretty much the exact thing I saw some older friends go thru...Care about their pets, want to get help, and can't seem to get any or get SOME but with hidden costs and "guilt trips" at the end. If no one said it, thanks for helping critters out and giving when you could. Sorry it was not rewarded.
donna mills June 3, 2013 at 01:20 pm
Gasp! Seriously? OMG--Poltergeist get behind me!!
rubberband June 3, 2013 at 01:48 pm
Donna...Poor Donna. My dear, it is too late. Call that weird yet cute little tiny lady toRead More "clean" your home and get your kids out of the television. ......oh and if you have a pool...DO NOT GO SWIMMING.
Dan Crandell June 3, 2013 at 01:58 pm
Love you Donna. Your comment should have been "Poltergeist get ""thee""Read More behind me"!!!!! All in fun.
Don Ryman May 31, 2013 at 10:07 am
ask andy Montgomery on fb
Robert Parry May 31, 2013 at 01:48 pm
I've recently spoken to Gayle. She's fine, just taking a bit of a mental hygiene breather.
Buzlightyear aka marty June 1, 2013 at 12:11 am
I am glad to hear she is good. I don't do facebook so I will simply take it that she will commentRead More again. She was my first "Patch" debate with someone on the other side of issues......You know, sentimental thing for your first time.... LOL. Just tell her Buzzlightyear "Marty" said hi if either of you two talk to her.